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Just another thread to hate on bows in CTF :)

Discussion in 'Server Suggestions' started by Lexxonist, May 3, 2020.

  1. Lexxonist

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    Lexxonist
    Oki doki let's begin

    1 - Too much damage
    Bows can do about 5 hearts of damage which is about 2-3 shots to kill someone with full health. Not only that, but bows have infinite arrows. Considering this is a ranged weapon, it causes for bow-spamming to happen over large distances which only gets worse when there's multiple people and as one gets closer to try and attack the bowspammers. The removal of the Power 1 enchant from the bow would solve this issue.

    2 - Bowspam
    Due to the infinite arrows, there is a huge number of bow spammers on Capture The Flag especially on maps that involve bridges or good areas to bowspam from such as Clash Valley, Seclusion, Sandy Fortress and Eruption. A limitation of arrows would, depending on the amount of arrows, limit or even prevent the amount of bow-spamming that goes on because arrows would then be an important resource to conserve to use if someone takes your flag, etc, not just standing at a bridge to bowspam from. The bowspam on such maps makes the games long and frustrating and there tends to be little to no chance of evading it because the alternative paths on many maps, for example Sandy Fortress and Clash Valley, are exposed to the areas that bow spammers use and since these two paths are surrounded by lava, there's little room to be able to dodge the arrows and once one is in the lava, you're either dead or at one heart to survive the next onslaught of arrows. I'd like to quote a player that I found mentioning bowspam on Eruption as I write this thread. (This is literally just right now which is why I'm including it). Screenshot_25.png
    This makes for a rather boring game of shooting arrows and that said I'm not even bad at archery but the bow-spamming gets crazy.

    3 - A hatred from the majority
    As someone who only plays Capture The Flag on MC-Central and does it for a few hours a day because I have no life. I have learnt that bows have caused a hatred and have been despised by the majority of people, of course there's still the minority who don't care and those who enjoy bow-spamming. Certain people wish to completely get rid of bows but I think that'd ruin the fun. Maps I have enjoyed about 2-3 years ago have turned into bow-spammer havens. This point is further enforced by the threads that talk about bows in CTF:
    - https://mccentral.org/community/threads/capture-the-flag-bow-spammers.65916/
    - https://mccentral.org/community/threads/ctf-bow-cooldown.25114/
    - https://mccentral.org/community/threads/ctf-kit-change.31909/

    Bow spamming causes numerous players from the losing team to leave, because, let's be honest, where's the fun in being bow spammed to death as soon as you try to leave the spawn area. Not only is it just no fun but it also makes the losing team lose more. Overall this not just impacts the experience of the players involved where there's an absolute stalemate or mass slaughter, but it can impact their continuity to play Capture The Flag on MC-Central.


    To conclude, something needs to be done about the bows in CTF. These include
    - Adding sharpness to swords (personally I dislike this)
    - Keeping a limited amount of arrows, removing infinity and keeping power (preferred because this means arrows will still do a lot of damage but it won't be crazy OP)
    - Removing power and keeping infinity (the arrows would do less damage this way but there will still be bow spamming so personally I dislike this one as well).


    Thanks!
    - Lexxonist
    :)
     
    Marco5py and abbzyy like this.
  2. Swinger

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    Swinger
    I appreciate the time you took with this, it's obvious you care about the gamemode. Honestly I think this is an argument of preferences, but I think you're over-blowing bowspam significantly; I've been playing CTF for upwards of five years, and people have always been utilizing it on almost every map. It wasn't a huge problem with the community back then, which was (IMO) significantly more competitive than it is now. Even CTF clans, which used to be huge, are now completely dead. The only reason a minority is being more vocal now (and it is definitely a minority) is because the game has shifted towards the casual side, with said competitive players leaving and new people joining the community who haven't learned how to deal with the game's mechanics. And despite this most games still end with someone capturing the flag amidst the bowspam, because even with people being worse at dealing with it, they still find ways around it. It's just a part of learning the game.

    I don't mind removing power from the bows. In fact, I think that would be good. I do think limiting the arrows is a bad idea. Maybe if there was a 20-30 arrow limit, and it replenished every time you died, I'd be more okay with it, but the game would get super boring for players if there was either a total cap (shoot 30 and you're out for the game) or even a small restocking cap. I don't want to have to shoot 10 times and then rely on my sword till I die. That's just boring, and would just encourage boring tactics. I love defending, but when I run out of arrows, I'm just going to kill myself. Don't love it, because I like a nice KD ratio, but that's what I'd do if it won games. What about attacking? You virtually lose the ability to hold down an attacking vantage point with an arrow cap, or the ability to use quick fire as a rod substitute. It's bad gameplay design.

    To conclude:
    - Don't bring back sharpness lmao what kind of bad balancing act is that
    - Don't add a cap because it's boring and encourages bad playing habits
    - Removing power from bows is the best option if there was to be a small change
     
    Zonafer, iiSean and creeper7777777 like this.
  3. Zonafer

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    Zonafer
    I entirely agree with Swinger here. One thing I would like to add is perhaps projectile protection I on chestplates, which would make arrows much less valuable and discourage bowspam in the first place, because it deals minimal damage. Otherwise, that's it!
     
    Lexxonist likes this.
  4. Lexxonist

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    Lexxonist
    That's a good point but that would, as you said, result in minimal damage, which wouldn't be as effective when it comes to shooting players with the flag, etc.

    Perhaps a separate defence and offence orientated kit would solve the issue and it would also encourage further teamwork?
     

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